Tonk is the easy target

[brock ratcliff]

You know what, if I were looking out for my own interest here (which is how this started when I saw MY area wiped out), I wouldn't even care at this point. As I've said countless times recently, my "area" is on the rebound. By that I mean I am probably going to have the best years of hunting ever in the next few years. That is solely because of new property being acquired by the guy I hunt on, and having almost sole hunting rights. The deer I'm hunting don't know they are even being hunted, and they will rebound on a very local level quickly - no one is shooting them! However, on a greater scale, I'm still not going to see deer in the general area while driving to and from the farms I hunt! The people that once hunted those other areas are still going to see very little...and will be told by the DoW, more specifically Mike Tonkovich, that they aren't hunting hard enough, or they aren't looking under the right oak tree... WHY? Is he not analyzing the data correctly, or is he a liar? I don't have a clue... You tell me, Mrex. He's your friend. You brought him to Strouds so we would all "feel better about the man making the decisions." I'll agree with you, he's a personable guy.... but our deer are gone en masse and no one that should recognize that seems to!

<--------------------- My sense of humor is intact!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Huckleberry Finn]

Fuggin get over Tonk. He's one dude.

Let me try to put it another way...

You're telling me that the deer herd is influenced and managed so much by one dude? When did the GOVERNMENT get efficient?

 

[brock ratcliff]

I'm sorry, Huck. If I've said something to bother you, feel free to ignore my posts.

 

[Big H]

How about looking at this from a different perspective? If we as hunters are seeing a diminishing population of deer in our hunting areas, then why do WE continue to shoot does?
The main problem is, that many hunters simply either don't care or don't know that the deer population is down and blindly just follow the bag limits or feel that they have to kill a deer in order to have a successful hunt. As hunters and land stewards we can really only control the property that we either own or have access to. To me the answer is common sense, if you aren't seeing enough deer, then stop shooting does for a year or two on properties that you are hunting. The main concern IMHO, would be how to educate the "once a year" hunters on surrounding properties to do the same thing?

 

[Huckleberry Finn]

I'm sorry, Huck. If I've said something to bother you, feel free to ignore my posts.

Nope, not bothering me at all. Just trying to make a point...

 

[Jackalope]

I am willing to talk. Always have been. I am a cordial person. Always will be. But when I see outright bullshit like i read today best believe the other side will be told. To put it bluntly. Here is how it will go. In two years we will have an election for governor. Our governor is going to have a hell of a go at it. He will need the hunters vote. Negative PR is never good. The easiest way to make an elected official look bad is to make his appointees look bad. It shows bad judgement. I agree with others here that Tonk is not the only problem. However shit rolls down hill and that's a hazard of the job so it would be nieve to say he is immune to the fallout. I hope he doesn't think for a second the director or the wildlife council will not hang him out to dry as a patsy. I didn't do it. He and his management team set about this path. I'm going to make sure I make it known far and wide what has happened and whose best interest they had a heart. As soon as I settle on a domain name for the PAC I will complete the PAC information I started filling out today. There are plenty of businesses in this state who have a vested interest in keeping deer numbers at a higher level than the dnr wants. Hunting in Ohio is a one billion dollar industry. Best believe I'll be looking for donations. Some may even come from Kasics opponents. They could give a crap less about deer numbers. But rather the sportsmans vote. Take Strickland for instance. 600,000 hunters is nothing to laugh at when it comes to preserving a vote. Best believe theyre willing to put whatever dirt out there necessary. And screwing hunters is a good one. And again, the easiest way to make a politician cringe is start drilling his appointees. It reflects badly on their judgement. Look at what happened to the dnr in Wisconsin. That was an election promise and it ended up getting him elected. Best believe our governors opposition knows how it was done. You might caution me to be careful what i wish for. We will see. But for now we can not continue down this path. We'll see what happens, hopefully the next appointee and head biologist will be a little more cooperative and hunter minded than their predecessors.

 

[CritterGitterToo]

How about looking at this from a different perspective? If we as hunters are seeing a diminishing population of deer in our hunting areas, then why do WE continue to shoot does?
The main problem is, that many hunters simply either don't care or don't know that the deer population is down and blindly just follow the bag limits or feel that they have to kill a deer in order to have a successful hunt. As hunters and land stewards we can really only control the property that we either own or have access to. To me the answer is common sense, if you aren't seeing enough deer, then stop shooting does for a year or two on properties that you are hunting. The main concern IMHO, would be how to educate the "once a year" hunters on surrounding properties to do the same thing?

How do we get that message to the other 500,000 hunters? What about the ones who boldly disagree claiming the experts(Dow) said to kill more deer? If there is only 3 doe left on the public land I hunt most someone, given enough opportunity, will finally kill them off.

 

[Jackalope]

How do we get that message to the other 500,000 hunters? What about the ones who boldly disagree claiming the experts(Dow) said to kill more deer? If there is only 3 doe left on the public land I hunt most someone, given enough opportunity, will finally kill them off.

By forming a PAC and geti g the word out, trade shows, d&t expo, media relations etc. The UAW only has 378,000 members in Ohio. There are over 600,000 hunters in a billion dollar industry. Thanks to the dnr, their lies, and population destruction The opportunity for representation has never been greater.

 

[CritterGitterToo]

By forming a PAC and geti g the word out, trade shows, d&t expo, media relations etc. The UAW only has 378,000 members in Ohio. There are over 600,000 hunters in a billion dollar industry. The opportunity for representation has never been greater.

Oh, I'm totally with you. Big part of why I am here. I was just making a point to BigH. I get so tired of people saying just don't shoot the doe anymore. That's cool for him, Mrex, and Brock. However, on public land I have no influence on the others hunting there. Thus, the need for us to take action on a collective level.

 

[Huckleberry Finn]

Has anyone written a single letter to ODNR?

You know, paper...signature and address...stamp...

to Tonk, Zody, Zehringer...hell, Kasich...anyone?

 

[Jackalope]

Has anyone written a single letter to ODNR?

You know, paper...signature and address...stamp...

to Tonk, Zody, Zehringer...hell, Kasich...anyone?

The postal letter? Lmao. Sure. That'll work. I mean. They can ignore online topics for years and never get involved. Ignore sheets filled out at open houses, emails, and even their own survey. But drop the bullshit ploy we got a letter in the mail! lmao.

 

[RedCloud]

Oh, I'm totally with you. Big part of why I am here. I was just making a point to BigH. I get so tired of people saying just don't shoot the doe anymore. That's cool for him, Mrex, and Brock. However, on public land I have no influence on the others hunting there. Thus, the need for us to take action on a collective level.

Not just public land bro. We are ALL in the same boat because last I knew none of us have a large enough track of land to manage a herd on so we are dependent on the DoW to do that for us but so far they are failing.

 

[Buckslayer]

Other than a change in the bag limit the only way to increase the population I feel is too not shoot doe, and the implement the $50 per coyote reward.

 

[LonewolfNopack]

How about looking at this from a different perspective? If we as hunters are seeing a diminishing population of deer in our hunting areas, then why do WE continue to shoot does?
The main problem is, that many hunters simply either don't care or don't know that the deer population is down and blindly just follow the bag limits or feel that they have to kill a deer in order to have a successful hunt. As hunters and land stewards we can really only control the property that we either own or have access to. To me the answer is common sense, if you aren't seeing enough deer, then stop shooting does for a year or two on properties that you are hunting. The main concern IMHO, would be how to educate the "once a year" hunters on surrounding properties to do the same thing?

That's why I spent about $200 in supplies and gas to drive to Vinton county to shoot my doe this year. I saved the doe that are left in Highland county for my neighbors to wound or kill. I still felt bad killing one there even, but I figured it would just be one less for one of the guys from South Carolina or Michigan to kill (who are paying the same amount of $$ for a tag as me. )

 

[Huckleberry Finn]

The postal letter? Lmao. Sure. That'll work. I mean. They can ignore online topics for years and never get involved. Ignore sheets filled out at open houses, emails, and even their own survey. But drop the bullshit ploy we got a letter in the mail! lmao.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Kaisch doesn't read TOO. I know you'll show me stats that others do, and that's ok. The governor does have a staff that opens and reads his letters, forwards them to agencies, and ensures that they are responded too. Scott Zody has a phone that rings on his desk and hip...everyday. With 20 letters, you could get a sit down meeting with Zehringer in 3 weeks. Who do you think is more likely to make a change on Tonk? You writing shit online, or his boss's boss telling him to look into something further? The guy who writes stuff behind a screen name on the internet, or the man that signs his paychecks?

For someone who didn't know who Zehringer was 2 months ago, good luck taking down ODNR, Joe. That'd be like taking down the DNC by attacking a state senator, without knowing who the president is.

I am blown away by this concept that the government suddenly got efficient. One dude making 60k determines the policy of our million dollar business...uh huh. Not gonna believe that one at all. Back to the original purpose of this thread, as Sam said, yes, Tonk is a great person to present your info and numbers and complaints too, but there are more people that should be taking heat - and I believe that those people would reply to you in a way that actually could change something. Further, you need to reach those people through the channels they are used to...phone calls and letters; not hidden and squirreled away on the internet.

News flash, Tonk isn't losing his job over this. He'll be retiring in however many years will all of his benefits whether or not you ever see another deer in the woods again...

 

[Milo]

Has anyone written a single letter to ODNR?

You know, paper...signature and address...stamp...

to Tonk, Zody, Zehringer...hell, Kasich...anyone?

Normally i would agree with you but after attending the division open house and having a DIRECT conversation with a wildlife officer....i will just say this, i'm betting that they use it to heat up their wood stove more than read it. I asked the licking county wildlife officer( 10+ year of experience i believe) about the direct disappearance of deer on 161 just west of granville....He said they built a few condos that changed the deer patterns...i just shook my head and went on. those fields just west of granville, for a decade or better, have been stuffed with deer. We used to place jerky bets on who could guess how many deer are in the fields when we drove by....they are not there any more. this is generally unhunted area of licking county...huge deer herds... OF course this fella didn't even know the area i was describing, in his jurisdiction, that i have been on seeing the decline. Curran was with me as a backup to the conversation

 

[Jackalope]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Kaisch doesn't read TOO. I know you'll show me stats that others do, and that's ok. The governor does have a staff that opens and reads his letters, forwards them to agencies, and ensures that they are responded too. Scott Zody has a phone that rings on his desk and hip...everyday. With 20 letters, you could get a sit down meeting with Zehringer in 3 weeks. Who do you think is more likely to make a change on Tonk? You writing shit online, or his boss's boss telling him to look into something further? The guy who writes stuff behind a screen name on the internet, or the man that signs his paychecks?

For someone who didn't know who Zehringer was 2 months ago, good luck taking down ODNR, Joe. That'd be like taking down the DNC by attacking a state senator, without knowing who the president is.

I am blown away by this concept that the government suddenly got efficient. One dude making 60k determines the policy of our million dollar business...uh huh. Not gonna believe that one at all. Back to the original purpose of this thread, as Sam said, yes, Tonk is a great person to present your info and numbers and complaints too, but there are more people that should be taking heat - and I believe that those people would reply to you in a way that actually could change something. Further, you need to reach those people through the channels they are used to...phone calls and letters; not hidden and squirreled away on the internet.

News flash, Tonk isn't losing his job over this. He'll be retiring in however many years will all of his benefits whether or not you ever see another deer in the woods again...

Nobody said he did read TOO. You seem to be under the impression that official channels "people are used to" are designed to achieve change. Lol. Yeah. Like open houses, and letters sure worked. lmao. How about you go call the NRA and tell them they're doing it wrong. All they have to do is write a letter. If that were true lobbyist organizations wouldn't exist. As for the rest of your post I'm not sure where to start with that silliness. There is the way government works, and how they portray it works. go ahead and write kasich a letter. Be sure to post the prewritten reply from an intern when you get it back, IF you get a response at all. As for talking to them. I fully expect we will have some conversations over the next two years and it won't be because I wrote them a letter.

 

[LonewolfNopack]

I do not want anyone to lose their job, but It is very frustrating to be paying these guys salaries and just to be ignored by them. Personally, I have done a lot more then just type over the internet. I traveled about 3 hours to talk to Tonk during the open house two years ago, and it cost me a job with the DOW. I am no where close to being done though. Short term setbacks are worth long term results. I want my children to be able to enjoy the great deer hunting in Ohio like I once did.

I am pretty sure that there is some type of corruption going on that is way over Tonks head, but I can not prove it. If anyone on this site knows more then I do, you NEED to contact the Internal Investigative watchdog group. These are the same people who investigated all the other corruption that lead to a lot of DOW employees being fired and even force the previous chief into resignation with cases still pending. Like I said, I would rather people just legally and ethically do the job they are being paid for instead of someone getting canned, but if corruption exists we need to weed them out and give our agency a fresh start. BTW, I do not think Tonk is going anywhere either. I am pretty sure he actually just go a promotion.

 

[Jackalope]

The bottom line is this. Organize a voice. Use that to bring pressure on officials and get that voice heard. It can only get better from there vs doing nothing, or going at it as an individual. The only thing that can come from that is positive change. Go where the river leads. What the dnr has been up to for years isn't going to reflect very good on kasich with sportsmen. You get to him by going at his appointee via awareness campaigns, media, and literature and you make sure it's know he was appointed under the kasich administration. Rattle enough cages you'll get a response. Rattle them hard enough and you'll get what you're after. Odds are anyway we're going to get a new governor. If you bring enough noise the new one will likely make a new appointment. Odds are the new guy will make new appointments also. Especially if he walked in the door to controversy. That is the essence of politics. And that is exactly how Wisconsins dnr ended up In the situation they are. Sportsmen brought a voice to an election. The governor to be used that voice in his campaign. He won, and made some changes.

 

[Gordo]

I think all huck is saying is 'the tonk' serves as the whipping boy of the ODNR.

I always say that is true of the US president, and wonder who is really runnin the show. I always come to the conclusion that it's ALWAYS money.

Same situation here? It's always a factor....

Whip on.....