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Dark side of deer mangement

rgecko23

*Supporting Member*
7,466
0
Massillon, Ohio
"Forget the antler size and focus on hunting bucks with some age, deer with which you have a personal connection. If November of 2010 proved anything, it proved that this approach can produce a very enjoyable and satisfying season. It is still all about the quest."

This is a great statement. Focus on having fun, and not shooting big deer. Been my problem for a long time "gotta shoot a big buck, gotta shoot a big buck", never did and a bad mindset. I am doing nothing but concentrating on having a good time.
 

brock ratcliff

Dignitary Member
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24,834
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I enjoyed the read. Its been pretty much my game plan since I started hunting older/bigger deer years ago. I quit using trailcams a couple of years ago, primarily because I know the deer I want when I see him on the hoof. Getting to know them too well took away from the experience for me. I think the point of the article was that a deer's score is not an indicator of the hunt. There are a lot of GREAT deer that will never have what it takes to add up a high score - don't overlook them. And I don't! :)
 

Fullbore

Senior Member
6,439
126
South Eastern Ohio
IMO, there is a dark side to trophy management. It's becoming a rich mans sport and we as hunters have a misconception that if a buck doesn't score 140" or more that it isn't a trophy. As the artical states, age is what makes a deer a trophy. Having a history with a particular buck, such as encounters, trail cam pics and sheds are what builds memories. With age comes MASS too. I try to hold out for a 4.5 year old or older.
Good read and already looking forward to this coming season.
 

ajupsman

*Supporting Member*
811
70
New Hampshire
I TOO like Bill Winke. He's one of the few hunting celebrities who doesn't make it all about him. This whole idea of having to shoot a big buck or your season is not successful can make us all nuts. My first year hunting in Ohio I passed on a couple of bucks I should have shot because I thought they weren't big enough. Last year was my 3rd year in Ohio and I passed on a small 8 point on the 2nd to last day of my trip for the same reason. I think its important we each decide for ourselves what is a trophy. If you're happy with a 1 1/2 old 6 point than so be it. It may not be the buck other hunters want you to shoot but who cares. I say your tag, your buck. Shoot what makes you happy.
 

hickslawns

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39,721
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Ohio
I TOO like Bill Winke. He's one of the few hunting celebrities who doesn't make it all about him. This whole idea of having to shoot a big buck or your season is not successful can make us all nuts. My first year hunting in Ohio I passed on a couple of bucks I should have shot because I thought they weren't big enough. Last year was my 3rd year in Ohio and I passed on a small 8 point on the 2nd to last day of my trip for the same reason. I think its important we each decide for ourselves what is a trophy. If you're happy with a 1 1/2 old 6 point than so be it. It may not be the buck other hunters want you to shoot but who cares. I say your tag, your buck. Shoot what makes you happy.

I couldn't agree more. Bill Winke is a good one in regards to TV personalities. Also agree the trophy is in the eye of the beholder. I passed a 115-120" 8pt last year with a doe. He wouldn't leave her. I was very close to shooting this deer simply because the story of the hunt and the memories of what I witnessed would have made that deer a trophy to me. I was at full draw several times and held off. I was later blessed with an amazing buck. Truth be told, the hunt and story to go with it on the 115-120" buck was an equally satisfying memory of last season.
 

Jackalope

Dignitary Member
Staff member
38,841
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I think its important we each decide for ourselves what is a trophy. If you're happy with a 1 1/2 old 6 point than so be it. It may not be the buck other hunters want you to shoot but who cares. I say your tag, your buck. Shoot what makes you happy.

I agree with this completely. However I can also see the other side of the coin. If someone doesn't care about horns then why shoot something with horns. Now, for kids, first time hunters, or something special like first deer with a trad bow I can see shooting a 6 point. Then the trophy is the animal and the hunt. But to go year in year out tagging 6 points makes no sense to me. Is it just so they can say "I got a buck" as if the sexual gender of the animal is what makes it a trophy. While I agree the trophy is in the eye of the beholder, we must be careful that we don't fall in to the PA mentality of "getting our buck" and disregard the fact that we really shouldn't be shooting 1.5 year olds on a yearly basis as a goal. To me it's like keeping a live well full of three inch crappie. Awesome and exciting as a first fish, a trophy indeed, get that sucker mounted. But it not looked at as good sportsmanship when you're a dedicated angler. The question then becomes where is that line drawn. 100 inches. 120 maybe 130. Now that's a gray area where shoot what makes you happy. That's like keeping a 8 inch crappie. A good fish indeed. Way better than 3 inches for sure. And I don't think anyone would fault an angler for keeping an 8 inch crappie. But if we're gonna be crappie fishing as a sport, a fat 13 incher is a hell of a trophy for a seasoned angler who should be tossing back those 3 inchers, not keeping them so they can say "I got my keeper"
 
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MK111

"Happy Hunting Grounds in the Sky"
Supporting Member
6,551
66
SW Ohio
All interesting thoughts. Then as I see it take what ever makes you satisfied. Be it a buck since Ohio is a one buck rule just satisfy your inter self.
In 2012 I passed on 7 smaller bucks as I wanted my 1st buck with a bow something I could be proud of for my so called inter self pride. I took that bow buck in 2013. I haven't made up my mind what I will do in the future as the monkey is off my back.
Maybe a buck with a PDC if it passes tomorrow's vote. We'll see.
Right or wrong it's what I wanted and needed.
 

brock ratcliff

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I agree with this completely. However I can also see the other side of the coin. If someone doesn't care about horns then why shoot something with horns. Now, for kids, first time hunters, or something special like first deer with a trad bow I can see shooting a 6 point. Then the trophy is the animal and the hunt. But to go year in year out tagging 6 points makes no sense to me. Is it just so they can say "I got a buck" as if the sexual gender of the animal is what makes it a trophy. While I agree the trophy is in the eye of the beholder, we must be careful that we don't fall in to the PA mentality of "getting our buck" and disregard the fact that we really shouldn't be shooting 1.5 year olds on a yearly basis as a goal. To me it's like keeping a live well full of three inch crappie. Awesome and exciting as a first fish, a trophy indeed, get that sucker mounted. But it not looked at as good sportsmanship when you're a dedicated angler. The question then becomes where is that line drawn. 100 inches. 120 maybe 130. Now that's a gray area where shoot what makes you happy. That's like keeping a 8 inch crappie. A good fish indeed. Way better than 3 inches for sure. And I don't think anyone would fault an angler for keeping an 8 inch crappie. But if we're gonna be crappie fishing as a sport, a fat 13 incher is a hell of a trophy for a seasoned angler who should be tossing back those 3 inchers, not keeping them so they can say "I got my keeper"

I agree, but only to a point. The thrill of deer hunting is short-lived. At least for me, and I suspect others as well. I enjoy hunting deer. I don't remember ever wishing I was doing something else, even when I had other things I needed to be doing. With that said, there is only one "high light" each season, and that is the killing of a deer. It is virtually impossible to continue shooting "bigger" deer each year. How is it at all reasonable to expect to harvest a deer over 160" in Ohio every year. It certainly is not in my part of Ohio at least. It's also foolish to hunt deer based on the size of their antlers, IMO. To not shoot an older age class buck based on him not have symmetry or whatever else it takes to "add up", is foolish. A 5 or 6 yr old deer is a trophy regardless of what his antlers add up to. To expect that each year you can kill an older buck is about a foolish as to plan on killing one bigger than you already have...if you've had any measure of success in the past. My goal each year is to kill one that strikes my fancy. Some years I get it done, some I don't. I'll be happy to end my time hunting with a barn full of "struck my fancy" bucks, and I'll never care what any of 'em score. Who knows, maybe one day a really, really big, world-class scoring type buck will wander by within range...but he'll have to be in front of a 130ish type deer for me to ever shoot him. The 130ish makes it to me first, he's getting shot most likely.
 

hickslawns

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Ohio
I have a great uncle, (God love him), that fits Joe's description. He has killed more deer than the blue tongue. Every year "Got my buck" on the first antlered deer he sees. He owns great land. Trophy caliber deer in the area. He simply enjoys shooting that buck. Doesn't mount it. Doesn't even eat it. Gives it to a neighbor or friend every year. He just loves to hunt. How can I, myself, judge him? It makes him happy. He has zero cares in the world about "deer management." Do I get it? Heck no. Can't fathom it. I am happy to see him get out and enjoy it year after year though.

I have been fortunate. I am at a cross roads this year. I believe I am in between Brock and Ron right now. Mature deer would be great. Not a reality year after year. Maybe every few years if you hunt hard. In my area, a mature buck kill every year is not a reality. Every third year is not a reality. My goal will be "a mature deer" in 2014. Something tells me, like Brock, if it tickles my fancy it will die. I suppose I will know when the moment arrives.
 

brock ratcliff

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Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to intentionally shoot a dink. But my reasoning is that I hate to use my tag. Fact is, when a deer comes along that is likely the best deer I'll get a crack at, I'm shooting. Several years ago I watched 4 bucks chasing a doe on November 3rd. The last buck was a 185"er. After they were out of range, I turned around and shot a 130" 8 point. That deer met my benchmark for that year and I didn't think twice about shooting him. As luck would have it, I put Sean in a stand on Nov 5 and he killed the big one at 12 yds. That did make me think twice about shooting that 8... :). Realistically however, those deer aren't coming, no matter how long you wait. One 4, or even 3 year old a year is all I hope for. And I could care less what it scores.
 
1,746
67
ohio
I agree, I have pretty good.bucks where I hunt on.average some with junk some without, I shoot what I want to shoot my first what I concider big buck was a 7 yo 6 pt wide and heavy never scored him, I think the people that strickly base the deer they shoot off of score are totally missing the point
 

finelyshedded

You know what!!!
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31,855
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SW Ohio
That was a very good read and I too like Winke as a hunter and a writer. He brings up some very good points. I also agree with a lot of what both Brock and Joe both said as well. I've come around to thinking along the lines of what this article was saying that in the long run that killing a deer with age is just as difficult or rewarding as one with huge antlers because of there wits and elusiveness.