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Whitetail fawn question

RedCloud

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North Central Ohio
I was sitting here thinking about what info Dante and myself have put together of the fawns in our area from this year and last years batch. Seems to me that the doe in our area have tossed down more BB fawns last year and this year and I have also noticed the sets of twin BB fawns on an increase as well. I know that having a doe or a buck fawn is just a numbers game but it just stikes me as odd over the past 2 years the deer numbers have flip flopped so bad.

Last year, You couldn't buy a buck for anything. Seen way more doe running around during the season.

This year, You can't buy a doe to save your life. Between my cams and Dante in a tree spending hours on stand we can only account for 4 different doe in our area this year.

I happened to drive out and wanted to see if Dante was hunting the property lastnight only to find him just getting to the grounds and pulled up sitting there watching through the bino's. We sat there and watched the field edges for a couple hours. We had on small 6pt buck walk out of an overgrown field not 15 yards from where we was sitting in our trucks. Last year you wouldn't have seen such a sight.

Has anybody else noticed an increase in BB fawns over the past 2 years ?

Like I said, I know it's just a numbers game of what a doe will drop but something makes me wonder if the environmental effects might have something to do with it as well. Much like rabbits with litter size. Good years they have big litters and bad years they may not have any at all.

Let me hear some of your observations and thoughts on this.
 

rgecko23

*Supporting Member*
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Massillon, Ohio
I have seen more bucks on my property this year, than in the 5 years I have been hutning there. I lamost blew this spot off because of never seeing them. Now there has been sightings of them all the time. I myself say its because of us putting very little pressure on the place and finally finding the right spot, but last years litter had to have an effect.
 

RedCloud

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North Central Ohio
I can't wait to take an overall inventory in late season around the feeder to see what happens. I know they say a BB will be your neighbors booner in a couple years after they wonder off but it just seems strange we have more bucks then does this year. I know my property is a little different then most in the fact that we have 3 different herds that overlap here. We only have a small amount of deer that live on the property all year long but we have 2 other groups that overlap and share the property with the locals. Just seems strange to have it flip flop that bad that quick. I don't know how much crop rotation had to do with it but I wouldn't think it would have made this huge of a change.
 

RedCloud

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North Central Ohio
Did a little more digging and found some useful information.

Factors Affecting Fawn Sex Ratios

To date, research has identified two factors that influence the sex ratio of whitetail fawns, doe age and time of breeding relative to onset of estrus (heat). Research by DeGayner and Jordan in Minnesota revealed that does 4.5 years of age and younger produced proportionally more male fawns while those older than 4.5 produced more female fawns (see Figure 1). Comparing extremes, 1.5-year-old does produced approximately 70 percent male fawns while 9.5+-year-old does produced only 30 percent male fawns.

Let’s examine the prevailing theory regarding how doe age could impact fawn sex ratios. Social organization within the whitetail world is based on a matriarchal system of related females banded together in individual family units. In most cases, the oldest doe occupies the highest rank, and serves as group leader. This “alpha” doe also selects the highest quality fawning cover, with lower-ranking group members taking progressively lower quality fawning areas. This system allows the oldest does in each family group to occupy the best fawning areas. Under such conditions, older does invest in producing more female fawns because these offspring are likely to survive and join the family group, thus maintaining the group and its genetic basis. In contrast, younger does, which are relegated to lower-quality fawning areas, invest in more males. This counters the over-production of females by older, dominant does. Also, since most young bucks will disperse (leave) from their birth area and travel 1-4 miles before establishing a new home range, they will not be relegated to the poor quality habitat of their birth area.

Research suggests that time of breeding within the estrus or heat period also affects fawn sex ratios. A study by Verme and Ozoga in Michigan reported that does being bred relatively early in the estrus period (13-24 hours), produced only 14.3 percent males, while does bred later (49-95 hours) produced 80.8 percent males.

The theory behind these findings is based on impacts to deer herd health. Within a deer population, time of copulation within the estrus period is determined largely by the adult sex ratio (number of adult does to adult bucks) and the age structure of the buck population (older bucks are more experienced breeders than younger bucks). Thus, does in herds with balanced sex ratios and abundant adult bucks would tend to breed early in their estrus cycle and produce more female offspring. In contrast, does in populations with skewed sex ratios favoring does, or those with insufficient numbers of adult bucks, would tend to breed later and produce more male offspring. The production of males when they are in short supply could be nature’s way of restoring balance.




http://www.outdoorchannel.com/Hunti...Strategies-to-Manipulate-Fawn-Sex-Ratios.aspx
 

CJD3

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NE Ohio
Good Thread RC.

I TOO have noticed this here. 3/4 fawns from this year are BB.
 

RedCloud

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North Central Ohio
Good Thread RC.

I TOO have noticed this here. 3/4 fawns from this year are BB.

I wouldn't have thought much about it until I started talking it over with Dante. Just something I overlooked until we started compairing notes and was just wondering if anybody else had noticed or stopped to even think about it. I know I wouldn't have otherwise if Dante hadn't brought it up and we started thinking about it.
 

Fluteman

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Southeast Ohio
I'm seeing a pretty equal amount of doe/bb fawns between the three pieces of property I hunt. One is about 50/50, and the other two are 25/75 and 75/25, offsetting each other. I am basing this off pictures I have of fawns paired with does, as that is the only high percentage way to be fairly positive I'm not counting the same fawn twice.
 

saddlepants

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central Ohio
This could compare with the tag restrictions talked about in the other thread. If more hunters took many more does last year then there could be the possibility of less "mature" does to then produce more doe fawns - thus the increase in Buck fawns?? Dunno, just a thought. I backed out of that thread due to the fact that I was misunderstanding it and had no business opening my mouth, lol.
 

RedCloud

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North Central Ohio
This could compare with the tag restrictions talked about in the other thread. If more hunters took many more does last year then there could be the possibility of less "mature" does to then produce more doe fawns - thus the increase in Buck fawns?? Dunno, just a thought. I backed out of that thread due to the fact that I was misunderstanding it and had no business opening my mouth, lol.

Could be a good possibility. I do know I found one of my older does dead of old age/infection of a tooth back in the late spring. I don't know how many others like her died off from old age in the last couple years and possibly left an age gap in the herd that may take a couple years to fill with older does to drop more doe fawns. Something to keep an eye on over the next couple years. Gives me something else to do in the off season...Like I really needed something else to do lmao.
 

dante322

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Crawford county
So lets say that in this area, 2 years ago, we had 20 does and only 5 bucks. The rut comes in and 5 of the does are bred right off the bat, and the others have to wait their turn. The reserch that RC produced suggests that the does that were bred later have more of a chance of dropping male fawns. That could explain the upsurge in bucks around here. So by contrast, if this year we have more bucks than does, the does will all be bred early and next spring the majority of the fawns should be female.

So I guess using my antlerless tag on a B.B. wasnt such a bad thing. If I still manage to get a buck out of the equation before the actual breeding starts, then that would have more of an effect on evening out the herd than killing a doe would have.

Hey R.C. instead of going after a doe, maybe you should be hunting a Button instead.
 

RedCloud

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North Central Ohio
So lets say that in this area, 2 years ago, we had 20 does and only 5 bucks. The rut comes in and 5 of the does are bred right off the bat, and the others have to wait their turn. The reserch that RC produced suggests that the does that were bred later have more of a chance of dropping male fawns. That could explain the upsurge in bucks around here. So by contrast, if this year we have more bucks than does, the does will all be bred early and next spring the majority of the fawns should be female.

So I guess using my antlerless tag on a B.B. wasnt such a bad thing. If I still manage to get a buck out of the equation before the actual breeding starts, then that would have more of an effect on evening out the herd than killing a doe would have.

Hey R.C. instead of going after a doe, maybe you should be hunting a Button instead.

I know where 3 of them are or was lol. Should be one over at the pasture and 2 brothers in the woods lol. There was a 4th but he got creamed by a car a couple months ago lol.
 
RedCloud,
Odd that you should bring this topic up. I called Hickslawns the other evening, about just this subject.

I've shot a buck and a doe, the last two seasons...both were mature animals. The doe that I shot had 2 BB fawns with her.

This year, I have yet to see more than 1 doe...period! So far, I have counted 5 bucks. A very nice non-typical, 2 other bucks that are 6 or 8 pts., a 3 pt. and a BB. I can not bring myself to shoot the doe, as she's the only live bait that I have for attracting the bucks in this area...and she's been living in the woods behind my house, all year.

I may end up filling my doe tag with this button buck. Meanwhile, I'm waiting on the non-typical to get within range. :smiley_chinrub:

Bowhunter57
 

hickslawns

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I have no info on the subject. Not even a knowledge of the area to take a guess. However, i did see on interesting thing take place tonight while road scouting. I had pulled off and saw 10 skin heads grouped up again. There were 2 yearlings that were out feeding and one lonesome doe that was separated from the other 9 does/fawns. When she joined up with them, two of the fawns ran right to her and started nursing. I haven't seen a fawn with spots in months, and this was the first I had seen any nursing in a long time. Weird?
 
hickslawns said:
I haven't seen a fawn with spots in months, and this was the first I had seen any nursing in a long time. Weird?
Neither have I, but the only doe that's in my area, that I was refering to, was doing the same thing about a week ago. When I spotted her, she was about to walk into a clearing, so I shot her with the laser rangfinder. She stood broadside at 34 yards, while I came to full draw, when her BB fawn decided he needed some milk to wash down the leaves he'd been eating.

That's what go me to thinking about how many does there are NOT in the area. She was directly under my stand, last night and I let her pass.

Bowhunter57
 

epe

Senior Member
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Lancaster
Neither have I, but the only doe that's in my area, that I was refering to, was doing the same thing about a week ago. When I spotted her, she was about to walk into a clearing, so I shot her with the laser rangfinder. She stood broadside at 34 yards, while I came to full draw, when her BB fawn decided he needed some milk to wash down the leaves he'd been eating.

That's what go me to thinking about how many does there are NOT in the area. She was directly under my stand, last night and I let her pass.

Bowhunter57

Does are getting a pass by me too this year. I can only account to two different does at my one location.
 

saddlepants

Member
1,224
0
central Ohio
I have no info on the subject. Not even a knowledge of the area to take a guess. However, i did see on interesting thing take place tonight while road scouting. I had pulled off and saw 10 skin heads grouped up again. There were 2 yearlings that were out feeding and one lonesome doe that was separated from the other 9 does/fawns. When she joined up with them, two of the fawns ran right to her and started nursing. I haven't seen a fawn with spots in months, and this was the first I had seen any nursing in a long time. Weird?

Fawns will nurse as long as the doe will let them. I shot a doe during gun season that had obviously been still nursing the two fawns following her even though they were getting pretty big, she was full of milk. they are like sheep and they usually dry up pretty quick (a few weeks ) after the fawns stop so her bag should have been pretty weak if they werent

And I too have only seen the one doe at home this year