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Article on canned hunts

Ohiosam

*Supporting Member*
11,708
191
Mahoning Co.
The quest for better deer -- specifically bucks with antlers as freakishly big as possible -- has created a rift among deer hunters.
Prize bucks are measured on a complicated scale that involves measurements between antlers, but suffice to say the more and bigger the antlers, the more valued the animal in hunting circles. But hunters who stalk deer through the woods and take them down the old-fashioned way are seeing their records obliterated by deer created by breeders and set free in enclosed areas for weekend warriors to bring down – and mount in mancaves back home.
"They’ve now created deer that are beyond human belief in terms of their antler size,” said Brian Murphy, CEO of the Quality Deer Management Association. “[The deer] staggers around under the weight of those antlers."
“[The deer] staggers around under the weight of those antlers."
- Brian Murphy, CEO of the Quality Deer Management Association
Murphy said some some deer are released into 10,000 acres of land, while others, in the most egregious cases, are released into three to five acres before they are shot down.
"Most hunters find great disdain in a known outcome," he told FoxNews.com. "That is not hunting. There has to be a high degree of not being successful. The deer has to have a fair chance to escape."
People who kill deer in that fashion follow "a code of ethics that is beyond reproach," he said.
The race for bigger deer has prompted some to fear that cloning methods, first pioneered at Texas A&M laboratories in order to protect the species, could soon be used to accelerate the race for bigger antlers.
In an investigative article written for Outdoor Life magazine, Chris Dougherty describes what he called "Frankenstein Bucks."
"One look at this pen-reared buck tells you there is something wrong, something terribly wrong. His obscenely disfigured antlers look more like something you would find growing on a coral reef or in a post nuclear war sci-fi thriller,” Dougherty wrote. “They twist and turn and droop and bulge and fork and then fork again."
But other deer breeding groups, like Michigan-based Whitehouse Whitetails, said there's no difference between killing deer in the wild and killing them in an enclosed space.
"They have the right to do that because it isn't to hunt. They just want the head to mount on their wall," said Laura Caroll, who, along with her husband, owns the deer breeding company.
"They [critics] are saying that one way of killing them is different from another way of killing them," she said. "But the end result is that they kill them."
"It’s no different than raising cattle that’s going to go on people’s tables," Caroll said.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/1...-deer-breeding-killing-methods/#ixzz2f4ljckqU
 

bowhunter1023

Owner/Operator
Staff member
48,879
274
Appalachia
Yes, the end result is the same. If that was what this was all about, we would call it killing and not hunting. Killing is a part of hunting, but it is obvious you don't have to hunt to kill if you want to go to these types of places...
 

finelyshedded

You know what!!!
Supporting Member
31,856
260
SW Ohio
Yes, the end result is the same. If that was what this was all about, we would call it killing and not hunting. Killing is a part of hunting, but it is obvious you don't have to hunt to kill if you want to go to these types of places...

Nothing else to add to this^^^^^^^. Jesse summed it up pretty dang good!
 

1hornwilly

*Supporting Member III*
Been on a few of these hunts. Some of you saw the beast I shot a couple years ago. It was really a cool experience and it was about a 5,000 acre ranch. So, it wasn't like shooting fish in a barrel, but I will admit it wasn't like hanging a stand in a spot you picked that you thought long and hard about either (far from it). I like doing both and I may go on another one someday, but there is nothing as fun as doing your work, setting up in the right spot and having a big ol buck walk under you because you set up there based on what you knew about that piece of land. I won't bust on anyone that likes to hunt on a high fence joint, but since I've done both I can tell you it ain't the same. I'd rather shoot a 140 that I did all the work for that a 350" (like the one I shot) that I didn't do anything but show up and let the first few 200"er's walk by because I knew there was bigger out there. Just 2 cents from a dude that just likes to hunt deer. I'm open to trying all kinds...next up for me, trad bow. I just like to try stuff I haven't done before and see if I can do it. I'll be visiting the trad forums for a few months to try get get some learnin from diablo TF and some of you other guys that go straight indian style.

moral of the story: I've got tolerance for it all...but, respect for the guys that do all their own work...and there is a bunch of you on this site.
 

Diane

*Supporting Member*
4,715
66
Newark
Yes, the end result is the same. If that was what this was all about, we would call it killing and not hunting. Killing is a part of hunting, but it is obvious you don't have to hunt to kill if you want to go to these types of places...

:smiley_clap:
 

yotehunter

Member
1,527
36
spencerville oh
My opinion is just that its not hunting. People put a lot of hours in trying to kill a 140 and some never do there whole life. But a guy can drive to a place that has 50 deer per acre a shoot a genetically altered deer and be In a record book just cause he bought a deer and has to rent a gun to do it with. Its just not ethical imo to shoot a penned up animal.
 

hickslawns

Dignitary Member
Supporting Member
39,721
248
Ohio
It isn't for me. I have no ill feelings towards Willy for his experience. Why would I? He didn't try to hide anything or play it off like it was a fair chase deer. It is what it is. I will admit though, even in the high fence world, Willy's deer was a freak. lol

Just not my thing. I have been on one semi-guided hunt. I am glad I experienced it. Sort of wish I had gone more with my gut and listened to the guide a bit less. I killed a doe while there. It just didn't feel like i was the one doing the hunting. I don't plan on ever trying a full enclosure hunt in my life. I would rather eat tags than buy a deer. Just me.
 

finelyshedded

You know what!!!
Supporting Member
31,856
260
SW Ohio
The quest for better deer -- specifically bucks with antlers as freakishly big as possible -- has created a rift among deer hunters.
Prize bucks are measured on a complicated scale that involves measurements between antlers, but suffice to say the more and bigger the antlers, the more valued the animal in hunting circles. But hunters who stalk deer through the woods and take them down the old-fashioned way are seeing their records obliterated by deer created by breeders and set free in enclosed areas for weekend warriors to bring down – and mount in mancaves back home.
"They’ve now created deer that are beyond human belief in terms of their antler size,” said Brian Murphy, CEO of the Quality Deer Management Association. “[The deer] staggers around under the weight of those antlers."
“[The deer] staggers around under the weight of those antlers."
- Brian Murphy, CEO of the Quality Deer Management Association
Murphy said some some deer are released into 10,000 acres of land, while others, in the most egregious cases, are released into three to five acres before they are shot down.
"Most hunters find great disdain in a known outcome," he told FoxNews.com. "That is not hunting. There has to be a high degree of not being successful. The deer has to have a fair chance to escape."
People who kill deer in that fashion follow "a code of ethics that is beyond reproach," he said.
The race for bigger deer has prompted some to fear that cloning methods, first pioneered at Texas A&M laboratories in order to protect the species, could soon be used to accelerate the race for bigger antlers.
In an investigative article written for Outdoor Life magazine, Chris Dougherty describes what he called "Frankenstein Bucks."
"One look at this pen-reared buck tells you there is something wrong, something terribly wrong. His obscenely disfigured antlers look more like something you would find growing on a coral reef or in a post nuclear war sci-fi thriller,” Dougherty wrote. “They twist and turn and droop and bulge and fork and then fork again."
But other deer breeding groups, like Michigan-based Whitehouse Whitetails, said there's no difference between killing deer in the wild and killing them in an enclosed space.
"They have the right to do that because it isn't to hunt. They just want the head to mount on their wall," said Laura Caroll, who, along with her husband, owns the deer breeding company.
"They [critics] are saying that one way of killing them is different from another way of killing them," she said. "But the end result is that they kill them."
"It’s no different than raising cattle that’s going to go on people’s tables," Caroll said.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/1...-deer-breeding-killing-methods/#ixzz2f4ljckqU

This is where I say, "bullshit" on many different fronts.


Great post Josh!(Hornwilly for those who don't know him)
 

Bigslam51

Dignitary Member
Supporting Member
25,778
127
Stark County
Not hunting at all. I don't understand how someone can go to a fenced up operation, sit in a stand that is already picked out because that's where the deer come through, and shoot a buck that looks like it has a giant octopus on it's head. How in the hell can a guy even brag about shooting a buck like that? You Can't. Has anyone ever watched the videos from World Class Whitetails of Ohio? That place is a joke.
 

yotehunter

Member
1,527
36
spencerville oh
It isn't for me. I have no ill feelings towards Willy for his experience. Why would I? He didn't try to hide anything or play it off like it was a fair chase deer. It is what it is. I will admit though, even in the high fence world, Willy's deer was a freak. lol

Just not my thing. I have been on one semi-guided hunt. I am glad I experienced it. Sort of wish I had gone more with my gut and listened to the guide a bit less. I killed a doe while there. It just didn't feel like i was the one doing the hunting. I don't plan on ever trying a full enclosure hunt in my life. I would rather eat tags than buy a deer. Just me.
yes no offense to Williy or anybody and Phil Willy was honest. I have been on a semi guided bear hunt and after it was done i wished I could do it on my own. Its just more rewarding IMO. And yes I'm glad I experienced it but don't know if I would do it again.
 

hickslawns

Dignitary Member
Supporting Member
39,721
248
Ohio
yes no offense to Williy or anybody and Phil Willy was honest. I have been on a semi guided bear hunt and after it was done i wished I could do it on my own. Its just more rewarding IMO. And yes I'm glad I experienced it but don't know if I would do it again.

If you haven't read the thread on it or seen the pictures, you should look them up. It truly is a sight to see and a good read. I think there are differences in these places. Some are 5 acres, some 500, some 5,000acres. Like BigSlam said, I think some of them you could do with your eyes closed but others are more like Willy's hunt.
 

mrex

*Supporting member*
439
79
"Canned hunts" will be the death of record keeping / conservation organizations like P&Y, B&C and the BBBC.
 

Beentown

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Supporting Member
15,740
154
Sunbury, OH
"Canned hunts" could be fun just not rewarding for me. Kinda like farming with hydroponics. You know the outcome because most of the factors are controlled. Their are a lot of things were I know what the general outcome is going to be but it is still fun.

Hell, if that weren't the case video games wouldn't be so popular for most men my age (I don't get that either).
 

yotehunter

Member
1,527
36
spencerville oh
If you haven't read the thread on it or seen the pictures, you should look them up. It truly is a sight to see and a good read. I think there are differences in these places. Some are 5 acres, some 500, some 5,000acres. Like BigSlam said, I think some of them you could do with your eyes closed but others are more like Willy's hunt.
10 4
 

Bigslam51

Dignitary Member
Supporting Member
25,778
127
Stark County
If you haven't read the thread on it or seen the pictures, you should look them up. It truly is a sight to see and a good read. I think there are differences in these places. Some are 5 acres, some 500, some 5,000acres. Like BigSlam said, I think some of them you could do with your eyes closed but others are more like Willy's hunt.

Hunting 5000 acres as opposed to 5 is different and more of a challenge, but the people that run these places still have these deer patterned to a t and they are still fenced in. Penned up is penned up whether you got 5000 acres or 5. Not for me.
 

bowhunter1023

Owner/Operator
Staff member
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Appalachia
"Canned hunts" will be the death of record keeping / conservation organizations like P&Y, B&C and the BBBC.

Mike, I'm curious as to why you think this. None of these organizations except entries from canned hunts, nor am I aware of any issues of late that came about because of a canned hunt deer interfering with official P&Y, B&C, or BBBC business. Is high fenced hunting on such a rise that it would allow SCI to crush these organizations?